Building A Multi-million Dollar Portfolio Without Using Money From Your Pocket With Dr. Benjamin Maciel

Why would you want to invest on credit or debt? It's very risky. I think using my savings that I've saved up for five to 10 years is much more risky.

Or using my IRA, that's a lot more risky than using the bank's money. I don't want my friends to use their own money first. I would much rather them raise money through the banks.

Welcome to Truly Passive Income. I'm Neil Henderson.

And I'm Clint Harris. And Today's guest is Dr. Benjamin Maciel.

He's a newly minted MD who built a 31 unit real estate portfolio during medical school using business credit.

From buying his first business at 22 to raising six figures in capital without traditional financing, Benjamin has turned financial creativity into a system for empowering physicians. He's now on a mission to help others do the same. Funding healthcare ventures and real estate with business credit, not burnout.

Benjamin, we're excited to have you here. This is kind of in a.

In a wheelhouse that, that I know a little bit about because I have a lot of physician friends and physician burnout is extremely real, especially since the pandemic. So thank you for being here. I'm excited to dig in. Please tell us about yourself and what we don't know.

That is by far the best introduction I've ever had so far since I started doing this consulting stuff last year. So that was an awesome, awesome, awesome introduction.

Thank you, sir.

I don't even know where to go from that. That was so perfect. But let me tell you, pretty much for me, I started in real estate at 22 years old.

I bought a property management business and, you know, started really small, maybe four or five employees, and then from there grew it into 13 to 16 employees, given the season with maintenance and tax and stuff like that. Ended up getting up to almost 350 to 400 doors and then exited. Because I was 27. My partner was in his late 70s.

I was living in the Midwest in the middle of nowhere, and so wanted to grow and progress in life. And I always saw medicine and healthcare as something spiritually fulfilling.

You know, I was in real estate where it was very numbers, very cutthroat, very, you know, dealing with realtors and brokers and those types of personalities. And I always saw healthcare as just something where it was so giving, you know.

And then kind of the pivot started happening is once I got into medical school, I started realizing how MDs, I mean, I would just talk about real estate because I started my real estate business, right, or restarted it. So to Speak during the pandemic.

And when I would talk about real estate, it was more so about md seeing the freedom that I had in terms of being able to take a flight home on the weekend to see my kids, in terms of being able to buy a nice new vehicle, in terms of, like, the little things that gave me a little bit more spirit while I was going through the dog days of medical school, so to speak, and those little things, you know, driving a nicer car, being able to take a flight home to see my kids, my wife and my kids, my family, those kinds of little wins along the way really fueled a lot of, I would say, productivity and helped me treat patients better, or at least be a part of that treatment plan when it came to interacting with patients.

And so all that kind of combined together has led me to the idea that, hey, I want to help MDs raise a bunch of capital using whatever receivables or whatever income they currently have, to then go out and start building out a real estate business.

So you. You're this rare breed that you actually. You were in real estate and then you went into medicine, Is that correct?

Yes, exactly. Yeah.

Well, I. My question is, what's wrong with you?

You know, a lot of people say that, you know, but I'll never forget this. I just remember I'm on a rotation, general surgery rotation or internal medicine rotation, actually, doctor.

And I said, hey, I need to get out early on Thursday.

And the doctor kind of looked at me because it was like the second week, and he was like, you know, here's another excuse from another medical student. He's gonna, you know, come up with some excuse that he has an exam or something like that.

And he asked me while he's sitting there plugging away, I said, yeah, I got a notary. A notary's gonna be coming by, so I need a couple hours because I gotta sign closing documents on a project that I'm buying.

And it was like, what the heck? Like, you know, it was.

It was a totally different conversation because he never heard an excuse like that, you know, and ever since then, he basically, you know, the entire time it was me trying to get information from him to become a better physician and then him asking information from me on how to be a, you know, get invested in real estate and all that kind of stuff. And he's still my friend now. I actually helped him raise some money maybe three or four months ago. But, yeah, there's.

It's just when people see real estate, they see freedom, you know, and being in in corporate medicine, a lot of people get excited about that stuff.

Yeah. Freedom of purpose is what we talk about here.

A lot of people are so focused on financial, but the, the reality is for a lot of physicians, they get into it and the, the time freedom is really the thing that eats them alive or the lack thereof. Right. You're trading time for money. And yes, it's a lot of money and it's got a high ceiling, but your quality of life is, is hard. Right.

That's tough. And so that freedom of purpose is what people are looking for.

And money doesn't buy happiness, but for the people that have money in no time, like they're not happy at all. What they would rather have is that freedom of time, because that can create the freedom of purpose. Right.

So like, it's, it's one of those things that when they're, they're looking at what you have sometimes, oftentimes the people with what you think you're looking for, which is lots of money, and you know, a white collar professional has great paychecks, they would really still rather trade places with you. What we really want together is that time, financial and location independence that creates that independence of purpose. That's what we all want.

We know that money doesn't buy happiness, but it does create options.

And I think options create the possibility of finding peace because it gives you a wider range of being able to select choices for your life that are more in line with the goals that you have for your family. Right. That's, that's what it's about. So it just comes down to the choices that you make should align with the goals that you have.

And money can just give you a broader range of choices. And if you make the right ones, I think you have a better chance of finding peace. You started out running a property management company.

You moved on to graduating med school with a real estate portfolio. You had no residency plans. Okay, walk us through this. So you, this is a pretty unconventional path.

And one of the reasons you chose this path is because you had a secret weapon, which is business credit. Talk to us a little bit about this.

What were you seeing at that time when you chose basically an off ramp from the medical career because of this business credit creating opportunity for you? Walk us through that.

Oh, yeah, for, for me, it was a, a series or sequence of events. Right. So I exit my property management business. So now I know what it's like being a business owner.

Now I know what it's like in order to create my own schedule. Now what I Know, I know what it's like to have that respect and to have the ability to say, hey, you know what? Revenue is kind of down today.

But if I make about 30 calls this week, or if I make about 40 calls this week, all of a sudden my revenues can go up and then I can go back to my normal schedule and take three or four days off. So now I'm used to being my own man, so to speak, right?

And so I get into medical school, and then all of a sudden I realize I'm the one that actually has to do all the work. I'm the one that has to study, I'm the one that has to be in the apartment. I'm the one that I can't sub all of this stuff out, right?

And then so I went to Caribbean medical school.

And the reason why I went to there is because I didn't want to go back to community college and go and do a postbac and all that kind of stuff, right? Wait three or four years. And so by the time I decided to be a physician to the time that I got into medical school was like six months, right?

Because they accept me right away. So I showed up with a. With a laptop and a pencil, you know, and some notebooks, no background, no nothing, and actually figured it out.

Had my transcripts the other day, actually was going through them, and I actually did pretty good, but it was kind of a sequence of events, right? And so one time I was on a flight going from Portland, Oregon, to Toronto, Canada. Toronto, Canada, down to the Caribbean. And on that flight, my.

One of the students that was with me, his name's Tamid, he actually invited me up to the lounge, and I was like, wow, this guy must have a lot of money, or his family must have a lot of money because he, he. He takes me to this lounge, has showers, it has beds, it has everything, right? Food, free food, you can. All you can eat.

I'm like, what the heck is this? Well, it turns out he has a credit card that gives him access to that specific lounge, you know, And I just.

I'm the type of person where I obsess over things, you know? And so I was so enamored. I was so like, wow, what is this?

And so I started looking into this credit card, and then, sure enough, YouTube algorithm, between my history and watching real estate videos, and then now credit card videos, I stumbled upon videos talking about using business credit cards to buy properties. And so I had all this experience buying properties, structuring properties, raising money, raising capital.

I, you know, and now I had basically unlimited capital when it comes to business credit and being able to raise money, so to speak.

You don't just raise money and all of a sudden get to the properties, that kind of thing. There's there. It takes time, right?

But for most people, they don't even have the money to get started, let alone to actually start investing, you know, and go through that dynamic.

And so I try and set people's expectations honestly and I tell them, hey, if you can raise 100, $150,000 in business credit, you're going to be able to stick around at least to get a, get a hold of the real estate business.

So I've often heard you say that you're not trying to just buy assets, you're trying to build your own partners. Walk us through, what does that actually mean? And how do you help a doctor become capital ready?

So, for example, you know, I'll get residents recently, right? And they'll contact me and they'll say, hey, you know, I'm a resident. I'm making 60, 70, $80,000 a year.

But man, I'm working 100 hours a week, you know, or that kind of situation, that kind of dynamic. And I say, well, you're really not an asset to me.

You have no money, you have no time, you have no knowledge, you have nothing, you know, and I'm very blunt about it. Just like I was in the property management business and real estate business. It was a property management business.

But I had to deal with investors all day, every day, and I had to be very honest with them, you know, and I had to be very direct. You're not an asset to me. The property that you bought, I can't turn it into a winner. I can't make up because you bought the property wrong.

You know, and sometimes, I mean, I have a. I've realized I come from athletics, I played college football. You know, my dad was a general contractor.

And so I can be very blunt when I need to be, but also, I can be, you know, very, I would say sympathetic at times, but at times when it comes to finances, people want to beat around the bush. And so I just have to tell People listen, if we were doing a deal together, you're not an asset to me.

You have no time to invest and you have no money to invest. And so what you need to do specifically is you need to figure out ways how to raise money and how to raise capital.

And so I can build out my partners by basically putting them through the process of raising business credit, using their existing income, rearranging it through LLCs and funding LLC. So then in maybe six to 12 months they have money to contribute.

Because as a resident you're not going to go out there knocking on doors, finding deals. As a resident you're not going to have the time or the expertise for most people to be able to build out a team that's facilitating leads.

So the only thing that you have to contribute honestly at the end of the day is your credit score.

You have a good credit for most of them, you know, and so if they can basically learn how to raise money, at least they can bring something to the table. Right? And so that's what I try and focus on is just getting people to where they can come to the table with something to contribute.

And that's what raising business credit and credit in my consulting business really is. It's just an, a way for them to get to the table to start on that path. Investing.

This is really interesting. So the three things that we always talk about that people have to have is time, experience and money.

You have to have those three things to have success in real estate investing. It doesn't mean you have to have all three of them. It means you have to have a combination of the three.

Can be through strategic partnerships, whatever it may be. If you're a resident, you don't have money, you certainly don't have time. Without time you can't get experience. Right?

When you say raising money, I think, okay, LPs like limited partner investors putting capital in, like Neil and I just closed out. We, we do self storage by the way. We buy old vacant big box retail buildings like Kmarts and grocery stores.

We convert that into climate controlled storage. So we just closed out a 10 million dollar fund where we have dozens of investors that have put money into that fund.

We take that capital and then we go deploy that. So that's what I think of when we talk about raising capital. But that's not what we're talking about here.

What you're talking about is, and I'm going to make a few assumptions here and, and I then I want to start really getting into the nuts and bolts here. My Assumption.

I like nuts and bolts. I love that.

I can tell you, I can tell the way that, that's the way your brain works. And so I want to take this a little bit deeper than just the surface level.

My expectation of the way this conversation is about to go is that there are creditors lined up to deliver capital to white coat professionals or people early on in their career because they think that those people are going to end up being high earn income earners and they would like to build and establish a relationship early. So what you're talking about raising capital is not from other LP investors.

You're talking about people lining up business, business credit and then basically manufacturing their spending so that you're generating, you're, you're turning and burning that credit so that you can increase the credit limit and every three to six months or something like that, you're going to ask for an increase of that limit. And so what you're really doing is instead of raising capital, you're raising the debt ceiling on the personal liability that those people can take.

And my assumption is that these credit lines are probably a very unique business structure or a unique lending product designed for medical students or white coat professionals early on in their career. So I have a, that's what my guess is.

And that you unlocked the algorithm that you need to follow to access those funds that you can then turn around and deploy.

And then you've created a coaching program where you're helping other people access that capital and then hopefully providing them with deals of where they can put that. Because even once they have money, they don't have the time or the experience. Is that what we're talking about here?

I think what you just described is a little bit more complex. I like to think of it much more simple. I think anybody that maybe listen to what you just said, it'd be a little bit overwhelming for them.

For most people in a practical sense, you take your typical resident that they have decent credit now, they have income, right. And they're paying bills on a monthly basis, et cetera.

Well, they don't realize that if they just started a funding llc, now they're a business or they have a business and they're building business credit in that name. Now it can be through a variety of sources.

Maybe you'll start off first with a secured credit card and then it can be an unlimited credit card or I'm sorry, an unsecured credit card and then that'll maybe move up to a line of credit, so to speak. And that's what it is just like you use personal credit cards.

What I'm saying is you're basically building business credit in a funding LLC or in an LLC name specifically so it doesn't show up on your business credit and just taking whatever bills that you pay regularly and building credit with that, establishing a relationship with four to four to seven banks, so to speak. And so that's all that is. Now the next level of what you're talking about is basically taking on investors.

You know, you're raising $10 million, $15 million, $20 million, etc.

What you can do, and this is in a different sense, is you can take those, those investors that you've currently invested with and you can say, hey, listen, I don't need your money, but if we work on this together, we can put together some lines of credit and you can use your credit first and then use your cash second when it comes to investing in these deals. And it's all about essentially opm at the end of the day, other people's money.

You know, my friend specifically, I would hate for him to use his savings on a real estate project with me and then some guy in Washington state or Washington D.C. 3,000 miles away from me changes interest rates and all of a sudden our deal just totally tanks, Right? That happens a lot of times. And so for me personally, I just think of how I would want to invest myself.

And then I just set up that consulting program around other people. Now a lot of people say, well, why would you want to invest on credit or debt? You know, it's very risky. Right, right, it's very risky.

Well, I think using my savings that I've saved up for five to 10 years is much more risky. Or using my IRA or borrowing against my IRA, I think that's a lot more risky than using the bank's money.

That is, for the most part, a lot of times unsecured, so to speak.

And so in a practical sense, for your everyday resident, everyday md, all it is is basically raising credit lines in their business's name, or if they don't have a business, setting up a business for them that they then can start building business credit with. And so I hope that makes sense. But in the grand scheme of things, the entire idea is I don't want my friends to use their own money first.

I would much rather them raise money through the banks, so to speak, first. And then, you know, if things maybe go bad or if we were missing on a payment or two, then they can dig into their savings.

Got it? Now how much money are we talking about? And then for one person, what are we talking about? 3 To 500 grand or a couple? Is it more than that?

And then because of that, obviously there's going to be a cost to that capital, likely variable rate. So we saw variable rate debt shoot up over the last couple of years.

It really changed the dynamics on a lot of, a lot of projects that are available right now. And the cost of that debt is cannibalizing your return.

So my guess would be you're encouraging people to do active real estate investments versus syndications.

Because typically you can make more if you're flipping properties or buying small, you know, single family homes, residential, small, multifamily, and doing it yourself, like what's what. That cost of capital has to have an effect on the type of projects that work.

So how much money, what's the cost of capital and what deals are people encouraged to do?

Yeah, and I like this because this is a more sophisticated actually application of where to put the capital. Right.

And so for the most times, for the most people that reach out to me, they're saying, hey man, I'm a resident, I don't know anything about real estate, but I just want to do something.

You know, I say, well, you know, the thing that you can do now is start working on your business credit and raising capital, learning the fundamentals of raising capital, business credit, borrowing, paying back. So that's kind of my, the niche people that I've been working with or that have been contacting me specifically, right.

I just want to do something now. When it comes to raising capital and actually applying it and multiplying it, so to speak, that's a completely different ball game.

I mean, there's just a range of different opportunities for you to make money. Now, specifically for me, and I'll never forget this.

And I don't want to say anything about syndications or that, anything like that, but when I went up to an investor one time and I said, look, if you give me $150,000, I'll never forget it. His name was Kim Jennings. I said, hey, if we do, if you put up $150,000, you're going to get like a 23% return. And the guy laughed at me.

You know, the guy laughed at me. I'll never forget that. And I said, what the heck, you know, this guy's laughing. Over 20 something return. I'm seeing returns here for 6 and 8%.

And then he started talking to me about brrrr investing, you know, buying, refinancing, building up pulling out your money out. Brrrr Investing people.

I don't want to waste the time on a short podcast, but if you look up Brrrr Investing, which is simply connecting with a successful operator in your local area, partnering on a deal, and you have essentially probably the best returns out there, you know, in terms of getting money and it coming back to you in a relatively short period of time. Now syndications and everything else like that, then you have to deal with syndicators and fees and.

But at the same time, though, you have a lot less stress. So it all depends on the person. You know, it all depends on the person. It all depends mostly on the people.

But for me personally, if you guys want to ask me personally what I do with my money and my capital, I have basically the experience that I can partner with people or I can allocate the capital in specific areas.

And I feel comfortable, you know, I feel comfortable going out there once or twice a week and knocking on the doors and walking through the job sites. If you go on my Instagram page, you actually see me out there even, even looking at deals and projects, how.

Much money is the average person able to access?

300,000.

Okay, so good to start a couple brrrs. Even though the. Neil and I both have brrrs.

But even though these days, a lot of times you have to leave some capital in there and we'll take that a step further. But Neil, I know you had a question and that's.

And, and real quick, I want to dig on that because you just talked about leaving capital in the deal. And so that, to me, you know, that's a hard phone call to make with somebody and say, hey, you know what?

You're, we're expecting to get 60, $70,000 back to you, but we're only going to be able to give you 35 to $40,000 back, you know. Now let me tell you guys on a practical sense, what that conversation looks like when you use business credit.

Hey, you put up $70,000 in business credit, you're only going to get $35,000 back.

So what you need to do is contact the bank and you need to renegotiate the payment terms, and they can set you up on a, on a debt relief payment program, or they can set you up on some different lower interest rate. You see what I'm saying? It's a lot, it's a lot easier conversation.

Hey, you know that business credit that you put into this deal or that we use to fund the renovations? Yeah. It's not going to work out. Here's the lending terms, here's the refinance, here's how it's all going to pencil out and work out.

So you need to contact the bank and you can do a renegotiation or payment plan with them. Banks are used to renegotiating payment plans. People aren't used to putting 70, $80,000 out of their own money and only getting 35,000 back.

So it's just a different conversation.

Now are the terms on the business credit, credit usually is there a, a balloon payment that comes due? That, that's, that's what they're renegotiating?

No, the, the thing that they're most likely renegotiating is the interest rate, right? So let's say you put out $25,000 on a business credit card. That's 0% interest for 12 to 16 months, right?

And then around 16 months, let's say for some reason the brrrr or the flip doesn't go through, et cetera, something happens and then at that point you contact the bank and say, hey look, this is, you know what the deal is. You either a pay the credit card off with your savings, right?

Or you contact the bank and renegotiate your interest rate, which a lot of banks are in the business of converting high interest credit cards to lower interest, either business loans or personal loans. They get really creative. Banks are used to this kind of renegotiation, so to speak.

Yeah, they move it to another bucket. A lot of times that opens up the capital in the first bucket. They can re lend that as well. I'm glad we're talking about this because this led this.

We're already answering the question that I haven't asked yet. So because a lot of our listeners are white coat professionals, just a real quick understanding of what brrr investing is.

That's when you're going to find a distressed property. Neil and I both done this a couple times. You buy a distressed property that needs some work.

So you buy it, you're going to renovate the property, which means forced appreciation.

You're fixing the floors, the kitchens, bathrooms, whatever, just like you would flip it and you're going to increase the value of the property, right? This value of the bricks and sticks. But then you're going to put a renter in place, they're going to sign a lease on that.

As soon as they sign a lease, you can take that paper to the bank, the bank will look at that.

And if they're covering the mortgage on or whatever they're covering, they will give you a certain debt service coverage ratio on that and they will allow you to refinance the property and that rent will cover the payment on that property and allow you to pull your money back out. Right. So the point is you're going into it with a recapitalization strategy and you can recycle the same money over and over and over.

Br R R R it's by, what is it? Rehab, rent, refinance, refinance, repeat. Right. So that's the idea, is that you're doing it over and over. And in theory, that's great.

You, you typically end up with a lot of single family homes. A lot of people over time will outgrow that and move on, but a lot of people don't. They stay there. Especially if you're a busy professional.

That may be a portfolio that you want to build out and you want to live there.

And it's a great spot to be because just like you did, you can take one chunk of capital, you can deploy it over and over and over and basically you end up with an infinite return. The problem is that right now interest rates are high.

We also had a significant run up in cost in the industry because of the money and the location independence that was available post Covid. So prices are at significant highs right now. It gets harder to find those deals.

Even when you do find the deal, a lot of time you have to leave money in there. And a lot of times over time, people get disenchanted with dealing with property management.

Now you're smart and you built a property management company. I have one my myself that manages our 14 air, actually down to 10, 10 Airbnb properties that we still have and it manages those in another 75.

And I love the vertical integration and reduce fixed cost that comes along with that. But here's the, the question coming out of that for me is the, the real key here is how do you recapitalize, right.

If you're using business credit, there is a cost to that. And so you answered my question already in two parts. Number one, you get the cost down.

If you're, if that money's gonna stay deployed, you don't wanna keep paying 10, 12, 14% interest on that. So if you can renegotiate that with the bank to something more palatable, I think that makes a lot more sense.

But anytime you're using money that has a cost of capital, you need to have a very clear recapitalization strategy. I think that that makes total sense with the brrrr strategy.

So I'm curious, I'd love you to tell me quickly where you're still finding those types of deals. You don't have to give away the secret sauce.

But from there I would like to make a switch for the sake of time, the conversation of purchasing buildings or businesses. Excuse me.

Because I know that you're passionate about helping other people buy businesses and a lot of them are PE businesses that are niched to the white coat community. And I think it's brilliant. We're talking about rehab centers, treatment centers, healthcare facilities.

You're probably talking about the silver tsunami headed our way.

So projects like that are going to require a significant more capital to get them started and typically have a very unique recapitalization strategy either through net operating, maximized income and a refinance down the road.

But tell me about where you're finding Burr Properties and what markets you like and then let's go into the conversation of what it looks like to start using that credit to buy businesses.

Yeah, I think just, just for the viewer, I think context is important. Right. And so for me it wasn't always, well, I already had the property management business. Well, I already had all these systems in place.

Well, I already had all these things rocking and rolling now like I have it going on. It started off with me again with business credit and just having the opportunity, having the capital.

You know, when I exited my business, basically I had money for medical school, I had, you know, money, but I didn't have money money to start investing in a higher end area like Portland, Oregon. Right. And so I had to get really going in terms of the business credit.

And I think that's where God really aligned everything for me in terms of meeting my friend in Toronto, Canada who had a credit card that then I was, you know, got interested and then YouTube algorithm, real estate, business credit, it all aligned for me. Right.

And at different times, different times and seasons throughout the journey in the last three to four years now, I have at times had to knock on doors to be my own property manager at night time. There have at times been different areas and different scenarios where I did have to get my hands dirty.

So I don't want the viewers to think that I just raised a bunch of money and then poof, there was a real estate business.

My consulting specifically is just to get you on the game board, so to speak, to get you that first $300,000 to then allow you to get the idea of even investing in real estate and becoming a player.

So I Just want the viewers to know that that's, you know, just start off small, you know, I don't want, I don't want to confuse them, you know, just start extremely small. Now, when it comes to actually finding deals, etcetera, you know, we are so spoiled. We are so spoiled.

Now you have all these apps and you have all these devices and you have the prop streams and you have the deal machine. And so it's very easy. I just go on YouTube and I said, how to prospect for real estate deals.

And you have the top five to 10 people in the real estate business that they love giving back and they love sharing information, right? And so you can see and you can piece together how they find deals.

And basically what it is is just finding motivated sellers, finding a list of motivated people in your area who want to sell and contacting them or partnering with somebody in your local area currently doing deals that knows how to find deals, that has the contractors, that has everybody in place, and then lending them money, keyword, lending them money. Now a lot of people, they'll say, oh, well, this is a common theme, right?

So now you're a resident, let's say, for example, you have $300,000 in credit to your name, right? And now you just found out that you're going to be in Austin, Texas. That's where you're going to end up living.

So now it's time to actually start being in a place where you can start doing real estate deals and building out a team, a business. The first thing you do is you contact the banks and contact hard money lenders to find out who the players are in your area.

You don't go to your local real estate network and go to the first person that you talk to who says that they own 30 doors or says that they own a hundred doors and trust them and then just do a deal with them.

I always like to think nowadays, now with what I know from financing out, so what I want to do is I want to contact a lender in the area and find out who the players are, and then I want to partner with those guys who are successful, who the bank trusts to loan the money to, and then I'll partner with them and then I'll find out the contractors and then I'll find out how they figure out deals and then from there I can kind of build out my own business, so to speak. So I hope that's an actual practical application of the capital. First you raise a $300,000, then you contact the hard money lender.

Or banker in your area and find out who the players are and then you know who the winners are in your local markets. So that to me makes more sense based off of my background in history and real estate now in terms of finding the deals, it depends, right?

Because that's not a passive, that's not a passive deal. That's a very active thing. Now if you notice, I have a contractor shirt on, right?

It's because I have a contracting company now and I knock on doors in higher end areas and higher end markets looking for flips. And my business is a contracting business, so to speak.

And so I'm knocking on doors but at the same time I'm coming as a contractor, not a real estate investor. And so if we get a job, great. But more than likely I'm going to go there to get a listing or to get a property.

Oh man. A lot of things you said there, very crazy. First of all, I'll start with this.

A lot of crazy in a good way or.

But all in a good way. A lot of people position themselves as the silver bullet and like this is the decision. I'm the coach, I'm the mentor, I'm helping you.

That's my business. And this is the silver bullet. This is the end product. Once you found me, you're in good shape. I love what you said about. That's not what this is.

This is a starting point. You're helping people get to the starting point of accessing capital, which is usually the number one thing that stops people. Right.

And then it becomes experience and finding the right deals.

So, and, and positioning yourself clearly, honestly, like that, like, look, I can help you get to the starting line and from there it's going to be up to you. I love that. I think it's, there's a lot of truth to that. And from there, I mean, I can tell what you're doing is a very, very active role.

But you get to the point with this that you have a little bit of success, you can take a more active or passive stance depending on what's right for you. I want to ask you about, for the sake of time, yours and the listeners, we're going to start rounding it out here.

I want to talk to you about the balance of purpose and profits. So you talk about, you've mentioned your faith and I know that you talked about having a business beside business credit.

Like, I personally believe that we're doing all this for money, but money doesn't buy happiness. I've got two young boys.

My goal is to create a life where I'm spending time with them and giving them a reflection of what a relationship with your father is supposed to look like.

So it's a reflection of the relationship that they have with their kids and that the things that we're doing together hopefully are a positive impact on their character and the people around us. And so we don't want to just be chasing dollars because it's frivolous. And 100 years from now, we're all gone. Right.

If we just give our kids money, I think it's likely that they're probably bad people.

If we give them purpose or something bigger than money, and money can obviously be a part of it, I think there's a better chance that they're happy, that the community's better, and that they're better people farther down the line than just money. Right. So you talk about you're obviously giving back, you're trying to help people. It's the same reason you got into medical.

It's the same reason that you're focusing on this side of the real estate business.

So what's the vision behind, you know, using business credit is great to get started with real estate, but what is a vision that you have to have a more socially impactful venture and putting profits maybe second? And how do you personally balance purpose and profits?

Yeah, so for me, really, it. It's like the Bible says, you know, start them off with milk.

You know, when it comes to raising money, just seeing somebody get approved for a credit line, all of a sudden, their entire mind change. They're walking around the hospital different, you know, their views, their dreams become reality.

You know, dreams that take 15, 20 years all of a sudden can happen in three to five years, realistically, using business credit, etc. And it gives them a little bit of confidence.

You know, not everybody is quick to take action, I've learned, because they're very afraid, you know, but if you just go online and you walk through the steps and you get approved for $100,000, all of a sudden you feel confident enough to start taking action, you know, and so it's kind of like building up people, building up men, specifically, and just building people, you know, just to get them on the wheels, you know, and then from there, we can start talking about real estate and consulting, you know, building out a real estate business, that kind of thing. Now, specifically, when it comes to buying businesses. Right. For me, medicine has been the thing that people will do for free.

Because you like helping people. I've had surgeons tell me I Do the surgeries for free. It's the clinic that I actually have to get paid for.

It's dealing with administration that I actually have to get paid for.

You know, and that balance between, okay, I want to serve people, but at the same time I do have to get paid and justified for, for my being here and dealing with this portion of it. You know, that's the part where I'm still trying to figure that out now. And that's an honest answer.

You know, that's a very honest answer and I don't want to tell you that I got it all figured out. I'm only 33 years old and I'm sure in 20 or 30 years I'll have a lot more time to give back.

But at the same time, right now what I'm doing specifically is I want to buy healthcare related businesses that I can see tangible results in people.

So when I buy a treatment facility, for example, which I'm gearing up to do here in the next probably 24 months, I can actually see a tangible effect, a positive effect on somebody or if I buy know, an assisted living facility, I can see a tangible improvement. I can see an impact on people on a daily basis. And so results for me speak volumes in terms of impact etc.

And so balancing profits and balancing morals and obligations to community and everything like that, to me it's kind of like having kids. It's just a part of your lifestyle, it should be part of your lifestyle.

I shouldn't even have to think about it honestly, because my services, the things that I'm contributing to the community in general should all be aligned with one purpose. And for me, my purpose is to try and get before God and justify my being here on earth.

And so if I say, well, this part of my life is going to be making money and then this part of my life is going to be given back and then this part of my money is being a father, et cetera. I've been at times where I was on the phone with my kids, with my kids around me, buying a real estate property.

And then at the same time I was studying medicine, you know, I had, I had first aid on my screen and that's a lifestyle, you know. And so I just try and make this, you know, entire thing my lifestyle.

And so when people go on my Instagram and they see my kids and then one minute, then they'll see me at a property in another minute and then they'll see me talking or messaging with the resident another minute, it's all combined there's no separation or division for me specifically.

We could go on quite a bit longer.

You know, I mean, talking about this strategy and I'd love to dig in more, but in the interest of time, we want to wrap it up and wrap it up with a question that we ask all of our, all of our guests, and that's that, what is a book that you find yourself recommending again and again to friends and colleagues?

Release your breaks.

It's a new one.

If you read the books. Release your breaks. I don't have the name of the author right now. I think it's. I don't even want to butcher the name, but it's called release your.

We'll put it in the show notes. Don't worry about that part.

We like to ask this question without letting you know about it ahead of time because we want that answer that just pops off fresh from your brain. So this is great. Tell us more about it and then we'll put all the details in the show notes.

Basically, releasing your brakes is, you know, we're born with a certain innate ability. We're born with strengths and things that we can't control. I can't control where I was born. I can't control, you know, my energy for the most part.

I can't control a lot of things. But what it is is essentially giving you permission, giving yourself permission against society, against a lot of rules, to take action, so to speak.

And so when you go through the process of releasing your own breaks, you know, I want to be, you know, an md. I want to have the dream of owning real estate. What is prohibiting me from that? Well, then at the end of the day, I realize it's myself.

I'm scared, I'm afraid. I'm not taking action. I'm not accepting knowledge from successful people. There are certain things that I have to release my own breaks from.

And so release your breaks. That's probably the best book that I would recommend to people. And then opposite, you know, probably the proverbs, stuff like that.

Awesome. I love that. Well, Benjamin Maciel, Dr. Benjamin Maciel, I want to say thank you for coming on.

This is a very unique strategy that we have not talked about yet in 130 plus episodes. So thank you for that. I appreciate your willingness to share. If any of our guests want to find out more about you, the services you offer or any.

Anything that you're working on right now, what would be the best way for people to connect with you and do that?

The easiest way to connect with me is my website benjaminmasiel.com or on Instagram @benjaminmasiel_md Excellent.

And that last name is M A C I E L Benjamin, thank you so much for being here. We really appreciate your time.

Absolutely. No thank you guys. It was a great time.

Thank you so much for listening and watching the Truly Passive Income podcast.

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